I have copied and pasted below some posts
and comments from FaceBook that started
around 12noon (EST)...I copied and pasted
them around 2:00PM (EST) on Thursday,
January 21, 2010...Please note the responses
to original post made by Joe McKeever,
well known in the Southern Baptist Convention as
a characterist, author, and preacher........
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Write a comment...Joe McKeever - Subject: Gay (i.e., homosexual) people. I had it all figured out, no grey areas in this black/white issue, everything crystal clear. Then, I discovered that someone I love was gay. Suddenly, nothing was quite so black and white as before. I began praying for understanding and wisdom from God.
2 hours ago · Comment ·LikeUnlike
3 people like this.
Amos Pressley - The issues surrounding friends and family who are negatively affected by homosexual behavior are indeed complex at times. Because it boils down to behavior, the issue of homosexual sex remains very plain and very black and white.2 hours ago
David C. Minton - The BIBLE is crystal clear on it ! All one can do pray for that person . Sin is sin no mater how one looks at it.
about an hour agoJoe McKeever C'mon guys. What's crystal clear? That we should hate them, discriminate against them, ostracize them, fear them, and treat them like lepers? Usually, David, my friend, when someone says this issue is crystal clear, it only means "don't bother me with a view contrary to mine!" about an hour ago
Sylvia Parker Killebrew - I agree Crystal clear! But...we are called to love them just as Christ loves us. Sin isn't measured. My sins are not less than homosexual sin! Thank God he forgives me when I repent and turn from that wicked way. about an hour ago
Bill Dunnam Amen Sylvia, - it's our job to love, it's God's job to judge
about an hour agoLisa Carter Right attitude Sylvia and Bill!
about an hour agoJimmy L. Taylor Neither acceptance nor toleration should be dependent upon our closeness to persons or situations
Careful when you judge, especially what you do not understand. Love can cast out intolerance as well as fear!about an hour ago
David C. Minton - I never said I hated them ...., I only stated what I have read from the bible . I do have family members that are GAY and I treat them no different than anyone else in my family. about an hour ago
Edie Miller Swingle Neil - Be sure and share your new insights. You can pray for others as you pray for understanding. I really want to share my love with everyone and being a Christian will open our eyes and our hearts. about an hour ago
Ted Rogers I am not gay. However, being gay is NOT a choice. It is something one is born with whether or not society and/or the church makes one feel it has to be hidden. In my worldly travels, I have known, befriended and loved many gays. Several were desperate to find a place to worship God, but felt shunned. Dr. McKeever is the best preacher I have ever ... See Moreknown in my life, but reasons such as this issue are part of the reason I turned to the more tolerant Episcopal Church. Keep praying, Dr. McKeever. This issue is FAR from being black and white.about an hour ago
Marty McKeever I've known and loved many gay people over the years, but would NEVER trade my Father in for a second Mom, or vice versa. I personally think that is a cruel & unusual thing to do to a kid, and is why I oppose same-sex marriage. 58 minutes ago
Marty McKeever Ted,- many people do choose to become gay, or not to. Not all, of course -- and a tragic few have that orientation forced on them though abuse -- but many have. It's also never been proven that anyone is "born that way", and there certainly is no test to determine whether or not anyone is gay. You simply are as you do. 48 minutes ago
Darrell Lynn Clark - I have several friends that are gay and had a relative that was; that fact has never changed the fact that I love them with all of my heart, but it also never changed the fact that I hated the sin, the same as I have with my friends that tend to spread gossip, lie, cheat, have adulterous relationships, etc, etc...I believe their is no gray area ... See Morewhen it comes to sin; you either believe the Bible or you do not. I have never admitted that I have sin "all figured out", because if I did, I would not continue to be a sinner saved by grace; I would be be a non-sinner if I had "it all figured out". We ALL sin and fall short of the glory of God. I believe there are some who have been saved and fall into a pit of sin that just cannot get out, it seems, but to say that sin is not a choice of the sinner goes against everything the Bible teaches. Sin IS a choice; you do not choose to be tempted, but you do choose to either give in to that temptation or to allow God to help you deny it...Seems pretty black and white to me; and maybe even some RED added in, for without the RED BLOOD of JESUS, none of us has a chance!47 minutes ago
· Carrie Hovey @ Ted - maybe the urge to steal and/or lie is born in us too but we need to make the right choice-44 minutes ago
Marty McKeever - Meredith Baxter Birney is a timely example. Did she discover at age 50+ that she was "born that way", or simply realize that she was a failure at loving men? I think she chose to try something different. 41 minutes ago
Write a comment...
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I think it is interesting the varying comments and opinions that this seemingly simple post by Joe McKeever brought out of people, including me.
But after a two hour period and over ten comments made, I am pleased to see that the majority still believe the Bible!
Over the years the morals of America have declined....The "moral standard" has never changed; that moral standard is the Holy Word of God! The Bible is our moral compass and guideline and it has never changed, nor will it ever change! But unfortunately, what our society has decided to accept as morality has declined; the societal moral line has been lowered to where many things are acceptable today when they were not several years ago....Take a look at what the television networks are putting out as the "accepted normal lifestyle"; carousing, drunkenness, sexual promiscuity, adulterous relationships, homosexual relationships, impurity, lying, cheating, etc., etc., etc.....These lifestyles are presented as "the norm" and , unfortunately, accepted by most of us as the norm.
If we will get back to the Bible and understand that God's outlook on sin has never changed, I know that this world would be in better condition....But first, we must examine ourselves and admit that we need to change our own lifestyles and change what we accept as "the norm"...."for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God," (Romans 3:23)....Sin is a choice; the temptation is not a choice or a sin, but when we decide, or choose, to give in to that temptation before us, that is when we sin....But God gave us redemption for that sin through His Only Begotten Son, Jesus Christ. When we accept Jesus as our personal Savior and Lord we receive that free gift of salvation and forgiveness for and release from sin....But the Bible also tells us that when we receive salvation it will show in our lifestyle - in the way that we choose to live our lives. If there is no outward change, then most likely there was no inward change....We must understand that because of our union with Christ we have died to sin and become alive to God; our new moral life is based upon our union with Jesus Christ, being slaves to righteousness, and our "marriage" we have with Christ (Romans 6:1-23 & 7:1-6)...."For if we have become united with Him in the likeness of His resurrection, knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin; for he who has died is freed from sin." (Romans 6:5-7).
It is time for us to get back to God and His Holy Word and understand that He and His Word have never changed, but that we and our morals have changed, individually and as a society....For if we continue to say we are not sinning, we are liers and are fooling ourselves....The Word of God says it better than I could ever hope to.........
"This is the message we have heard from Him and announce to you, that God is Light, and in Him there is no darkness at all. If we say that we have fellowship with Him and yet walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth;" (I John 1:5-6)
"but if we walk in the Light as He Himself is in the Light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus His Son cleanses us from all sin." (I John 1:7)
"If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar and His word is not in us." (I John 1:8-10)
"'Come now, and let us reason together,' Says the Lord, 'Though your sins are as scarlet, They will be as white as snow; Though they are red like crimson, They will be like wool.'" (Isa. 1:18)
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As a matter of fact, sin IS the norm. It is a fact of life due to the fallen state of our race. It is easy for us to categorize sin into some type of top ten list. When in reality, "small sin" (ie. little white lies, etc) is just as grevious to God as rape, murder, assault, etc.
ReplyDeleteSin can be any action, inaction, or attitude that is contrary to the law of our creator. We understand that the Bible is very clear on sin and it's result. We easily say "hate the sin but love the sinner". However, as ambassadors for Christ, and reciepients of Grace, we are called upon to be conduits of Grace. It is non debatable that lost folks are on their way to Hell. Unfortunately, sometimes we sound like we are glad about it! Oh, how our hearts should be broken. We must "Build bridges" not just to "get over something", but bridges of relationship and love to ALL sinners - that they might find forgiveness, and a relationship with God. The desperately need the message of Grace and that message is most effectively delivered by those who model it in their own lives.
I agree that sin is the norm; we have all fallen short...But my point was that we as Christians have fallen into the trap of accepting the sin and degradation found on our TV and movie screens as being the "normal lifestyles" instead of being outraged by it...We need to be conduits of grace as we spread the Gospel to a lost world and anyone who knows me knows that my heart breaks for the lost and I am not happy that many are dying and going to hell; we must love the sinner but hate the sin, but, again, my point was toward the acceptance of this sin, no matter what it is, as "being OK" and not as going against the will of God.
ReplyDeleteNothing in my comments remotely suggested the acceptance of sin. The Christ follower certainly is enjoined to live holy and godly in the midst of a crooked and perverse generarion. My point is that no matter how much we may rant and rave against the darkness all around us (entertainment, godless lifestyles, and perversions, etc) that will not change it in the slightest. Jesus calls us to be salt and light. The only light we can bring is that Good News of His Grace, Mercy, and Love.
ReplyDeleteShould Christians abstain from sinful practices and amusements? Certainly!
Should we "accept sin as being OK"? Of course not!
But all of our outrage will not change the fact that we live in a fallen world, and the vast majority of the population is held in the slave market of sin. Only Christ can purchase them from that slavery. Our responsibility is to share that light.
There is a way to right the wrongs of this world, and it has nothing to do with cursing the darkness, protesting, passing laws, or boycotts.
Let me use as an example, one of your favorite Bible passages. When Paul was in Philippi and had been deprived of his "rights" as a Roman citizen, he was publicly beaten and humiliated. He and Silas were cast into prison with the common vile criminals. Instead of protesting, vilifing the persecutors, or raging against the system what did they do? While battered, bloodied, and chained, they prayed and sang praises to God.
The result? The jailer asking them, "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
That night he and his whole family accepted Christ.
You and I are on the same side. We believe the Bible and we know the terrible result of sin. I'm just saying that Cursing the darkness doesn't change a thing. Reflecting the Light of Christ does.
I agree with you wholeheartedly! I believe that is what I was saying as well, but maybe not as eloquent or clear....I do agree that we waste our time cursing the darkness, when we should be shining the Light of Christ to the sin-darkened world. We are on the same side and saying the same thing, just in a different way...AMEN!
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